In the August 31 episode, state Representative Richard Hayes explains why he wants voters to change the definition of a quorum. State Representative Sheryl Cole responds to the punishment Republicans are debating for the quorum breakers. And state Representative Cody Harris discusses his legislation that puts a temporary stop to moving water out of east Texas.
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Straight ahead, plugging a leak in the state water plan. Lawmakers stepping in to stop a project that would pump thousands of gallons of water out of East Texas. But is it now also time to update the 120 year old law allowing it? Chairman Cody Harris with us from the Capitol. Republicans considering several ways right now to punish Democrats for their quorum break.
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One idea would change the state constitution, and state rep Richard Hayes says a Democrat has even expressed support for it. But can Democrats defend themselves against the fallout from the quorum break? They are asking why flood relief has yet to make it to the governor. State Rep Cheryl Cole takes our questions from Austin. And a new trend developing in the Republican race for US Senate. John Cornyn now closing in on Ken Paxton.
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Inside Texas Politics with Jason Whiteley starts now.
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Thank you for joining us here. Despite a holiday weekend, there is a lot happening politically across our state. First up, the race for US Senate on the Republican side appears to be tightening up all summer, Ken Paxton had a double digit lead over John Cornyn. A new survey now shows Paxton might be losing that head start. He's at 42%. Cornyn at 37% in this latest poll from Echelon Insights. It's the 3rd survey this month showing a single digit race. Polls, of course, are only a snapshot in time.
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The battle over new political lines in Congress has left the legislature and now heading to court. Two lawsuits now filed over this. The NAACP and LULAC both have sued, arguing the new maps dilute the political power of blacks and minorities. President Trump asked Texas to remake its congressional district so Republicans could keep control of Congress next year. And for those of us constantly upset about the ever rising property taxes, here is a proposal you might want to watch.
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It's House Bill 299, the property appraisal lock, and if passed would lock your home appraisal to your purchase price. Republican state rep Shelly Luther introduced it, arguing that to be taxed on an unrealized gain is outrageous. All right, punishing Democrats for that quorum break is next up for the state legislature.
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One idea they're going to consider changes what a quorum is, reduces it from 2/3 of all members to just a simple majority, and that means Republicans could meet in the House of Representatives without Democrats even there. State Rep Richard Hayes, a Republican from Denton County, is proposing this and says one Democrat has even expressed support for it. Representative, welcome to the program here. Let's talk about the Joint Resolution 10. If this were to change the Constitution, voters said, sure, let's do this.
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Would minority parties ever really have any leverage in Texas?
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Well, I don't think it's about leveraging. It shouldn't be about leverage. Texas is only one of 4 states that has the 2/3 requirement for a quorum. So 46 states say majority is a quorum. And that is the rule with most every organization. Uh, a majority of your members constitutes a quorum. And, uh, the minority party, to kind of answer your question, always has input. You know, we're not enemies.
< spk_2 - 00:03:25 >
We're, we talk with each other, we work with each other. Probably 85% of the bills we pass are really nonpartisan. Um, there's a few bills every session that seem to get everyone's blood pressure up. Uh, but even on those bills, you know, we work with each other. We're on committees together, we're down the hall from each other, we have lunch together. And so it's not so much about leverage, it's about communication, and I think we have excellent communication.
< spk_0 - 00:03:52.8600000 >
Yeah, there's no question this, this was a political stunt to break cor that's what they are. But, you know, I, I've been talking to some of your folks, uh, some of your friends on the other side of the aisle, and they say, well, listen, if, if this were to pass and become part of the state constitution, it would just criminalize dissent.
< spk_2 - 00:04:07.7590000 >
No, no, they can still have dissent. They can ask questions during our committee hearings. They can do it on the floor, they can talk to us in the hall. Quite frankly, most of the work is done, not on the floor of the house. It's done in the committee. It's done in the halls. It's done over lunch or it's done over dinner when we're working on bills. It's staffer to staffer, and those things, uh, it's just a disservice for those, uh, not to happen.
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What kind of reaction have you had from your Republican colleagues?
< spk_2 - 00:04:36.8290000 >
Well, so far it's been excellent. I have, uh, 77, uh, members who signed on to the bill. And, uh, I'll say even a Democrat has signed on to the bill. It's, let's say 76 so far Republicans, uh, one Democrat, and, uh, there will be others. A number of the Democrats are OK with it. They just say, hey, we want to trade something for, uh, coming on board and supporting this. And I said, OK, we're like, what are you looking for?
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And they said, well, Why don't we, uh, be able to pay our fines, which are about $9300. Why don't we pay our fines from our campaign funds? Well, the current rule says you have to pay that out of your personal funds. You can't pay it out of your state operating account, you can't pay it out of your campaign, I mean, your, uh, your, uh, yeah, your campaign funds has to be personal funds. And, uh, my response has been, hey, that's above my pay grade. That's a backhaul decision.
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Um, you need to go talk to the speaker about, you know, that maneuver.
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Who is a Democrat who signed on to this so far or or expressed uh agreement with it?
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John Bryant. And John, you a lawyer, longtime rep member, longtime US congressman, came back to the House in 2023 and he just says it's good public policy. And that's what we're talking about. What do we want our public policy to be?
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Representative, it's good to see you. Thank you for the
< spk_2 - 00:05:55.4590000 >
time. Thank you, sir. Very nice to be on the program. Thank you for having me.
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All right, let's bring in the roundtable to talk about the politics of this. Natalie Haddad is here, a political reporter at WFAA in Dallas. Ashley Goodot is political director at Ky View in Austin, and Ayamitra, of course, senior managing editor at the Texas Tribune. Ay, let's start with you. Are you surprised at the strange bedfellows there that, uh, John Bryant is on board with this, uh, proposal from, uh, Richard Hayes?
< spk_3 - 00:06:21.2200000 >
Yeah, strange bedfellows indeed, but it's kind of an interesting thing when talking about process, you know, and John Bryant's, it sounds like from Representative Hayes is basically talking about process and that regardless, uh, you still have to govern, and I think that's, it's an interesting thing to discuss because, uh, you know, uh, uh, you know, whether, whether, you know what what whether you're in the majority or minority there's still. The whole process too I think the bigger question here too is like, you know, is there still representation in that in that process and that's the thing that'll probably be debated in this legislation. Yeah,
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that's certainly the balance there too. What are you expecting Ashley, as far as punishment from Democrats because Republicans couldn't even gather enough votes internally for a censure for Democrats.
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Yeah, I mean, I think that as of right now we're probably gonna stand where we are right, which is the fines that you have to pay the fines out of your personal funds, but I think there will be something else that will come, but it's a, it's a very tricky tricky road to walk because again you've got to work with these people on the other side of the aisle to get some of your legislation passed. Yeah,
< spk_0 - 00:07:22.2690000 >
they do have to work together, Natalie, but at the end of the day, I mean what kind of message does it send if Republicans aren't even on board with this,
< spk_5 - 00:07:27.7090000 >
you know, censuring. It is symbolic of taking away seniority is even harder. I think at the end of the day, GOP knows that they will risk pushback because even though they are the majority and Democrats are the minority, they still, the Democrats still represent so many Texans. So you know, I think this is just, I'm not surprised by this outcome at all.
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Yeah, and at the end of the day, like you know Ashley said too, they do have to work together to pass other legislation that may not be as controversial. Guys, thanks so much back to you all in just a moment and a lot more ahead here, including this. When we come back, the other side of this conversation, state rep Cheryl Cole, a Democrat from Austin on what options her party has right now. And is it time to update a 120 year old state law?
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Just ask folks in East Texas, worried that one big water project could empty out their aquifer. Chairman Cody Harris on the statewide implications when Inside Texas politics returns. Welcome back to Inside Texas Politics. Now to the Democratic response. Our next guest is one of the quorum breakers, state rep Cheryl Cole, a Democrat representing parts of Austin, who joined us from her office at the Capitol. Representative, welcome back to the program here.
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Uh, Republicans have several ideas to punish quorum breakers. What are you expecting?
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Well, first of all, let me say that there's only been a quorum break 4 times in the last 50 years, so this is an extreme and rare thing to do, and I'm expecting them to try to silence the voices of the minority, and the only thing, Jason, that will require to be here to vote on is the budget. It is a tool that is time honored for people in the minority party to utilize to stop legislation that's going forward.
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You know, Republicans could not agree on on punishment and didn't want to strip seniority from Democrats there. Do you think that opens the door at all for any negotiation?
< spk_6 - 00:09:30.7800000 >
Well, I certainly am not in favor of making Texas, Washington, and I'm hoping that there are more people on the Republican side of the aisle that feels the same way. Um, of course, the parties want to try to negotiate on these fines and fees.
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Uh, we just interviewed Representative Richard Hayes, a Republican from from Denton County. He's the one that has a proposal to reduce the quorum from 2/3 of all members down to a simple majority and he said something that surprised me. I just confirmed it. Representative John Bryant, Dallas Democrat who I know you know, uh, he, he's, he's fine with that. I, I texted John Bryant. I said I just wanna make sure I understand this, that you are OK with, uh, this and, and, and have signed on to it. He says he's, he's fully supports the quorum break.
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He was involved in it, as you know, but he thinks that if, if voters elect such slim majorities, those slim majorities still have to govern. What are your thoughts on that? Is, is there, is this something you could get on board with?
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No, I still think that a quorum should be 2/3 of the majority, but you know, when we're making these rules, you have to realize with the party in power might not always be the party in power, and so you wanna make the rules with the somewhat I to fairness to both parties and what is required for them to represent their constituents and us going on quorum break was definitely. A nuclear option that we had to do because the integrity of voting rights was at stake.
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Thanks so much for the time.
< spk_6 - 00:11:02.0200000 >
Yes, thank you. Thank you, Jason.
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All right, turning now to a big water project in East Texas that is coming to a halt. The state legislature now stepping in to stop a man named Kyle Bass from drilling wells in East Texas and pumping that water out to other parts of the state. There's nothing illegal about it. A 120 year old law here allows anyone to do this anywhere in Texas. State rep Cody Harris is a Republican from Palestine who chairs the House.
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Natural Resources Committee and says the state first needs to find out how much water is there to even work with. Mr. Chairman, thank you for the time here. Let's start with this study here. What, what do you expect the study to find?
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We don't have a good understanding of the, the science behind our aquifers throughout East Texas and throughout the entire state of Texas. The Carrizo Wilcox stretches from, you know, way up in northeast Texas all the way down to the, the South Texas um area and. In, in reality, we just don't know how much water is there. That's the whole purpose of this study is to hit pause. We're not saying that we're never gonna export water out of East Texas.
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We're just saying we need to have a really good understanding of how much water is there and how pumping affects that water, um, in the future.
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Texans. With this may not realize it, but there's a 1904 law that I, I know you know about called the rule of capture, and, and it allows, uh, anyone, a landowner to pump and own all the water beneath their property even if it depletes their neighbor's water supply. It it seems to me like the rule of capture is what needs to be updated here. Why not just go in and and amend that.
< spk_7 - 00:12:40.7500000 >
That's a great question, Jason. You know, in the last special session or the first special session, I did file a bill to change the rule of capture, but I did that knowing that, um, you know, this is a, this is a conversation that probably does need to be have over the term of a full interim and going into a full legislative session. Uh, to go in and figure out the best way to change a law that's been in place for 120 years, uh, may be too quick to try to do that in a special session.
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So, absolutely, I agree with you, it's time to modernize the rule of capture, but not entirely do away with it, but it. In reality, oil and gas used to be straight rule of capture, uh, 100 years ago, and they recognized the need to change that when they understood how it affected property owners.
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So now we're starting to get to that point where, uh, with high capacity water production, neighbors are being impacted in a, in a, in a substantial way, and it's time for the legislature to take a hard look at that.
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So is the idea to do the study, find out what you're working with here, and then try to amend it perhaps in the future?
< spk_7 - 00:13:45.1500000 >
Yeah, I think so. And, and, uh, you know, that may not be something that gets done in one session, honestly. Big, big, hard issues like this typically take 1 or 2 or 3. Session, regular sessions to, to finally get across the finish line.
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Kyle Bass is the Texan who wants to extract this water and he's now threatening to go to court over this. Do you expect that the state might have some exposure here, some damages perhaps? Because bass has purchased these 11,000 acres.
< spk_7 - 00:14:13.8300000 >
Yeah, I, I really don't think so. I mean, it is the legislature's role to, to be stewards of our, uh, our most precious resources, and we have set up groundwater conservation districts to do that, uh, and, and we've given the ability for local, local areas to set up groundwater conservation districts, but they are an extension of the state. Uh, and so it is absolutely within the purview of the legislature to, to step in and say this is how we think you should do things.
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Texas has 9 major aquifers, as you well know here. What's to stop Kyle Bass or any other entrepreneur or company from going in and, and, and, you know. Different parts of the state and, and drilling these wells and exporting water right now. What what's to stop anyone from doing that?
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That, that's why hitting pause on this project is so important because I believe that if we don't, you will see a proliferation of these types of export projects throughout Texas, uh, depleting our aquifers and, you know, we, we're going to solve the water crisis and, uh, you know, utilizing the groundwater in East Texas is one day gonna be part of that. Uh, but I think we need to be going after, uh, seawater desalination, brackish groundwater desalination.
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We've got 8 or 9 million acre feet of unallocated water in Toledo Bend Lake that we can pipe out. Um, so I think that groundwater should be the last resort because it's such a precious and finite natural resource. Source, but what's to protect people from uh that happening tomorrow if they're not inside a groundwater conservation district just like Houston County is not and they're part of these projects, there's rule of capture, uh, on its face applies so somebody can go in and pump as much as they want without permitting.
< spk_7 - 00:15:55.6550000 >
uh, so a GCD or groundwater Conservation district is really all that's there to protect someone.
< spk_0 - 00:16:01.5650000 >
Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the time. Good
< spk_7 - 00:16:02.8850000 >
luck. Jason, thank you very much for having me.
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The round table is ready when we come back here on Inside Texas Politics. And keep up with Texas Politics all throughout the week. We have a podcast called Yalltics, new content, fresh interviews. Episodes drop every Sunday wherever you get your podcast, or you can watch them on our plus app that you can download for free there on your smart TV.
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This is Inside Texas Politics with Jason Whiteley.
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All right, time now for Reporters Round Table to put the headlines in perspective. Natalie, Ashley, and I and all back with us here. Ashley, let's start with you in the expanded special session. In the first special session, a bipartisan bill passed allowing people to register same day to vote if they move within the county, maybe moving down the street or into a, a different neighborhood. But now legislation in the second special session is undoing that. What's going on?
< spk_4 - 00:16:58.7290000 >
So there was this kind of alarm and let's be clear about what this bill was it just said if you moved within the county, so when you went in and they checked your address you would already move instead of you know having to file a provisional ballot, you would have been able to actually go ahead and cast your actual ballot, but there was calls that was like, oh no, is this same day voter registration and we know that that does not get a resounding, uh.
< spk_4 - 00:17:22.4300000 >
Level of support here in Texas and so then we eventually had the the Texas GOP sending out fundraising emails talking about we must put a stop to this and Governor Greg Abbott added it to the call to not only stop that but to also expanding the call to ban all same day voter registration in Texas and it just seems like this call for this special session just keeps getting longer and longer. And longer,
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longer and longer as the days get shorter. Let's talk about the dueling endorsements also that we've seen, uh, recently. Natalie, uh, Senator Ted Cruz is getting involved in the, uh, attorney general's race. He backed Chip Roy, uh, former employee of his, and then, uh, Attorney General, uh, Ken Paxton has backed a former employee of his. Aaron writes on this. Where do primary voters line up behind Cruz or behind Paxton?
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My money is on Cruz. Cruz endorsing uh rather Mr. Chip Roy. Ted Cruz has a loyal grassroots following. He's got name recognition, and I think Mr. Chip Roy is going to have to really lean into that. He also has to lean into his own name recognition and as as as a critic of Paxton as well. And also, you know, he's, I think if anything, uh, what Chip Roy is going to have to worry about, uh, outside of any endorsements or not getting endorsements is how he's going to.
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Round up any MAA Republicans because he's also been a critic of Donald Trump. Yeah,
< spk_0 - 00:18:43.0690000 >
and those MAGA Republicans are the big primary voters here. I mean this race was already going to be a big one in the state, Ian, but when you have Ted Cruz getting in this early and Ken Paxton getting this early, I mean the lines are drawn.
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It's a really interesting divide in the primary and so as Natalie said, you know, Cruz's endorsement helps Chip Roy kind of buttress support against some of that criticism that he hasn't always been aligned with President Trump. But ultimately, you know, the biggest endorsement will be if, if President Trump does actually. Endors in this race and that'll be the, that'll be the kind of like the center for, you know, uh for the primary
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yeah and that's the big endorsement that both sides obviously want the congressman and Aaron Wrights. Uh, we started the program, Ashley with the news about uh John Cornyn closing the gap in the Republican race for US Senate, uh, with, um, his opponent there. Are you surprised though Ken Paxton is losing his lead this early?
< spk_4 - 00:19:40.8000000 >
No, I'm not surprised at all. I, I think that there was a lot of, uh, you know, I don't wanna hope right around this, but as things continue to come out about, uh, AG Paxton, you know, it's really hard to shore up that conservative Christian base when you have things like, you know, you now you're in the middle of a divorce because your wife says she found out about more infidelity.
< spk_4 - 00:20:08.4790000 >
And you know things of that nature and I think that what you're really seeing from Cornyn's team is they are pushing that they are constantly pushing all of this sort of drama that is happening around Paxton and his personal life and that eventually is going to seep into the primary and
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it seems like it is right now, Natalie, on the one side you have Cornyn really leaning into. Uh, you know, MAGA and President Trump on the other side for for Paxton, he's kind of mired in this, uh, you know, divorce news that Ashley mentioned.
< spk_5 - 00:20:38.9790000 >
Yeah, I really want to reiterate what Ashley is saying. I, you know, a couple of uh Inside Texas politics episodes ago we were talking about endorsements that Paxton may want to seek out and something I said was skeletons eventually come out of the closet and now that they are out of the closet like actually said it's going to be really hard to round up the conservative base when you are uh. Going against some of their values,
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yeah, yeah, and, and you know the, the, the last thing here I I can think of in the final, final few seconds is that we still have a long way to go before the March 3rd primary and, and, and these polls are, are kind of starting to be roller coaster already.
< spk_3 - 00:21:15.7900000 >
Oh yeah, absolutely, and the roller coaster may continue, but I think with Senator Cornyn this is very promising in the sense of like he is locking in some of that support. He is aligning with Trump, and also, you know, don't underestimate the support that he has with the Republican Senate campaign committee too.
< spk_0 - 00:21:31.0200000 >
Yeah, no, indeed so he has that, uh, long time with them, and DC is pulling for him as well looks like too, guys, thanks so much. We appreciate your insight and thank you for watching as well. We're back next Sunday to take you inside Texas politics and we hope to see you there. Take care.